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Re: OWNERSHIP: redistirbution 2 - absolute property rights



Michael
 
I did not want to change the direction of your discussion and nor do I really have the time right now to get into a debate.  My work load right now is quite heavy and I am so far behind I think I am first, but, because of my involvement in politics the issue of abortion has been made a hot topic.  I just wanted to mention a point that was presented to me by a former radical pro-life campaigner.  This particular gentleman had been very active and very vocal for several years.  He asked me to not mention his name because of his dedication to the cause  but he found it impossible to carry on in the cause for what he refers to the human element and religion.  He told me that he had discovered that most, and he related a statistic that I have forgotten, something above 70% if my recollection is correct, of those obtaining abortions are young girls who, together with their families, belong to religious communities.  The most common reason he gave me for abortions was to prevent the community and in may cases the family, from finding out about the pregnancy.  The stats he referred to were Alberta stats and how he obtained them I have no idea because these type of states are not made public as far as I know. 
 
This gentleman told me that the pressure to project an image of being good or chaste was greater than that of giving birth to a child out of wedlock and the profile that the debate over abortion intensified the pressure.  He said that he felt that he had no choice but to stop his campaigning because he felt that his involvement and the continued debate was a major part of the problem.
 
I know this has nothing to do with property or your direction of the debate but I thought it necessary to pass it along.
 
Chick 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, July 07, 2003 9:21 AM
Subject: OWNERSHIP: redistirbution 2 - absolute property rights

I was reflecting over the holiday on the three inalienable rights of live, liberty and property (also known as the pursuit of hapiness to fudge the slavery issue in the Declaration).
 
It seems to me that while all of these rights are inalienable, it is impossible to maximize all three in all situations.  In fact, sometimes they are in conflict.  As Laswell first said, the allocation of values (he had eight, for now I will stick to the three basics) is the primary function of government.
 
Let us look at some examples.
 
In the Middle Ages, and even later, theivery was a capital crime.  Therefore, property, especially noble property, was more important than life, especially the life of a peasant.  Nowadays, property is more important than liberty, meaning that thieves lose their liberty by taking property (instead of simply paying a fine - although to some extent prison for property crimes is a form of debtors prison, as those who cannot afford to pay a fine were imprisoned while those who could were allowed to to avoid jail in some places).
 
The abortion question is a classic example.  Sometimes abortion is a question of Life v. Life, the life of the mother vs. the life of the child.  Sometimes the question is put as the health of the mother vs. the life of the child.  Of course, because under the constitution, rights literally begin at birth - or the ability to be born (viability), the Court has fudged the issue.  Sometimes abortion is justified (badly) as the liberty of the mother vs. the life of the child.  Only the shrillest pro-abortionist puts it in these terms.  Rather, the essence of the pro-choice argument is that the mother has a liberty interest versus the society (rather than against the child) in making the determination to end the pregnancy.  Most doctors who perform abortions do so because if they did not, others who would put the life of the mother in danger would.  It is also the case that when abortion is made illegal it is much harder to procure one! when the mother's life is truly in danger - and the wheels of government are too slow when such a life or death decision is to be made.  TIn the case of incest, abortions are thought to be necessary due to the likelihood of genetic deformity (although this can be tested) so that their is a life interest in avoiding bringing to term a child with a fatal birth defect.  Again, legalized abortion prevents government interference in this decision, which is best left to doctors. 
 
The other reason for abortion has to do with both life and property.  This is the most common conflict over abortion.  It occurs in two cases.  Young teens have a property interest in their future (teenage pregnancy also has a higher risk to the life of the mother, depending on her physical condition).  In many cases their parents insist that they terminate their pregnancy in order to secure an education and be able to acquire a decent level of property.  The other case is of a family wishing to limit the number of children to its income.  This is both a property and a life question, as many fear that if they have too many children starvation and malnutrition are real possibilities, so life interests are implicated as well as property. 
 
As I have written on both my web sites, redistributional taxes and the empowerment of youth are a way to remove the concern of life versus property, by simply instituting a negative income tax in the spirit of the Earned Income Tax Credit (only larger by 6 times) to remove this concern.  Using corporate rather than personal income taxes is considered a better vehicle for this, as it more neatly integrates the payment into salary and by doing so hastens the day that employee-owned firms adjust salary for child birth as a matter of course, ending the need for tax incentives for this purpose.  Continuing to rely on personal income taxes, or even capital credit for each child, keeps the government's hand in this question forever.  Adjusting corporate taxes is therefore the more libertarian alternative.
 
To say that redistributing income for the purpose of providing for an income for family size is to put the property interests of taxpayers over not only the property but also the life interests of the beneficiaries.   The poorer the recipeint, the greater their life interest.  In a perfectly competitve labor market where the worth one adds to the product is the sole determinant of the base wage, larger families are out of luck unless some explict payment is made for the subsistence of children.
 
Also, at the concrete level (watching the money flows rather than justifying them as taxation versus money creation and capital insurance), improving the access of poor individuals to credit in such a way that ultimately denies credit to wealthier individuals has the same affect in terms of total wealth flows as redistributional taxation or the redistribution of incomes within a firm due to the imposition of a redistributional tax credit for families as part of an expanded corporate income tax. 
 
The capital flows between a negative personal income tax on an individual level and an expanded corporate income tax are the same because of the role of employers in withholding and paying personal income taxes for most workers.  If the EITC were expanded to $500 per child per month (federal) with a match $300 per child state credit, tax rates in general would have to increase and employers would take more from higher salaried employees and give more to lower salaried employees with larger families (assuming the change were revenue neutral).  In concrete terms, it matters not at all whether a personal income tax or a corporate tax is used for this, except that using the corporate income tax eliminates the obligation to file taxes and pay interest income from lower-income employees.  Employees above a certain level would continue to file personal income taxes, so that they may keep their non-employment related financial information away from their employers.
 
Finally, the whole argument that CESJ makes stating that shifting personal income taxes to employers removes visibility from government spending and taxing decisions is more Milton Freeman and Norm Kurland than Louis Kelso.  I am not unfriendly to the goal of ultimately limiting government involvement in fiscal affairs, although I would do so by privatizing corrections, mental health care, education and assistance to the poor while making the payment for these services to some providing organization mandatory (though in lieu of a tax system).
 
Michael Bindner